James Wanke: [00:00:00] So this one landed right around $25,000 MRR. It was a Peer Marketing Hub play. Obviously there was a lot of contacts, dedicated IP, transactional email and then Operations Hub naturally from more of a data cleanliness standpoint and data quality standpoint. 

Stephen Saberin, Aptitude 8: Welcome to the domin8 podcast. On this show we talk with HubSpot's top sellers and support about their latest wins, pulling back the curtain to explore the challenges they ran into and the sales strategies they use to win the deal. I'm Stephen Saberin, Senior Partnership Manager at Aptitude 8, the world's top HubSpot consulting firm. 

I'm speaking with James Wanke, Global Services Consulting Team Lead. It's great to have you on the show, James, and really look forward to hearing some more details around this particular deal, how you were able to successfully work with the team to close this deal, but before we dive in, tell us a little bit about you, your background, how'd you get started or get into the sales realm and make your way [00:01:00] into the HubSpot ecosystem?

James Wanke: Yeah. Thanks Stephen. I appreciate you having me on here today. So I got into sales a little bit, through the back door you might say. I actually came from an implementation background. Before HubSpot, I was implementing digital asset management solutions. So, you know, Fortune 500 companies who needed a place to store their digital assets, was actually on the implementation side.

I think that gave me a really good lens into the importance of a proper sales cycle, setting proper expectations for an implementation in the sales cycle. And eventually led me to really wanting to be part of that expectation setting and selling process. So, I've kind of found my, my drive for sales, if you will, from really looking to help those who are trying to make an informed and a right decision on how they go about implementing a solution, knowing that that really plays into the overall larger ROI and the larger picture of what customers get from platforms.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: What would you say is. I guess what's different about selling in the HubSpot [00:02:00] ecosystem and, and kind of tagging to that, what's the most rewarding part of selling in the HubSpot ecosystem?

James Wanke: Yeah, I think 

James Wanke, HubSpot: the most rewarding part is being able to help those that are stuck in a place where, 

James Wanke: you know, 

James Wanke, HubSpot: they don't have a good solution. 

James Wanke: They don't have something that's as easy to use as HubSpot. They don't have a central source of truth like we can offer really throughout in the entirety of a business.

And so I think seeing the results of it, especially being more on the implementation focus side of it of aligning partners like Aptitude 8 to really help drive the outcomes that we know we can achieve and together seeing the outcome and the business results from that. 

Like, I think kind of 

James Wanke, HubSpot: tying that all back to the partnerships that we're able to align on the pre-sale side is really the most rewarding part of it.

James Wanke: And watching those businesses continue to grow, and knowing that HubSpot and the solutions we're able to put together are a central part of that is, is ultimately what I find really rewarding.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: That's awesome. Before we dive in, one question I typically ask everybody is tell me something about you. [00:03:00] Can be personal, professional that most people either don't know or don't expect.

James Wanke: It's a really good one. You put me on the spot here. I would say like, you know, I've got a passion outside of work for running. Most people don't see me as a runner, but I think that's like where I do my deep thinking. I've done a couple of marathons. My wife's done an Ironman, so I can't live up to that.

I always lose in the household battle there. But I think running is kind of like my side gig, if you will, of like something that gets me away and it gives me time to think through my thoughts. And, a lot of times thinking about not selling HubSpot, of course.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: That's awesome. Best I've done is a 10K and I think that's about as far as I'll go.

James Wanke: You got to start somewhere. You got to start somewhere.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Yeah. Right. Maybe one of these days we'll take on a run together and I'll, you'll have to like, you know, drag me behind or something.

James Wanke: Let's do it.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Oh man. All right. So about the deal. Before we jumped too far in, give me some background on the client, how they got to us. lay of the land.

James Wanke: Absolutely. So, I think, you know, this is a [00:04:00] more upmarket client, which is where HubSpot is headed here these days. A HR and finance company was really looking for an alternative to also using Salesforce today. So I think a pretty typical, if you will, kind of HubSpot customer or more of our ICP of what we like to go after. And they were ultimately looking to find something that is going to allow them to scale more efficiently over the longer term. So they were finding their marketing efforts to be very cumbersome. They weren't able to get the information from Salesforce, their CRM, in a meaningful way, enough that was allowing them to really be targeted and personalized in their marketing outreach.

And ultimately they had also planned in the future to do some mergers and acquisitions. So I think that was an added component of how do we plan not only for today, but how do we plan for where we know they're headed as a business in the near future. And I think what was interesting about this deal too is that, you know, the kind of their ideal customer profile was very similar to that of HubSpot. More of that mid- to [00:05:00] small growing business is kind of their typical customer size. And so there was a lot of you know, I would say similarities in how we go-to-market, that we could also kind of on a partnership perspective share ideas and thought leadership around what that looks like.

So, we engage with them. We knew it was going to be a pretty lengthy process as they looked for an alternative while also going through some executive changes on their side, which I think added another layer to the mix here of how we approached and strategized around the deal. But ultimately we're able to find a way to move them forward in the process and get them feeling comfortable that HubSpot was the right solution for them.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Early on, were there any other competitors that you were aware of?

James Wanke: Absolutely. So of course, Salesforce was in the mix with their marketing solutions, having already had the CRM business. They were also looking at a few other more niche players in the industry. And so I think we had to both kind of fend off what they thought of is maybe a more robust platform than [00:06:00] what they were currently using, as well as something that was a little bit more simplistic, but quite likely too simplistic for what their needs were going to be moving forward into the future.

And so I think we were able to really position ourselves as, "Hey, we are not only the right solution for you today, but we can be the right solution for you as you continue to grow and evolve without adding the additional complexity, additional administrative burden that typically some of those other platforms might put on you."

And , not only create confidence in HubSpot, but also naturally a little bit of doubt in what those other solutions could offer them.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Yeah. And, you know, I know you mentioned, some of their challenges that they came to you with. Was there anything that particularly stood out? Like what was their key challenge or was there anything there that you knew would be an additional challenge that you'd have to overcome in order to prove that HubSpot would be the right tool?

James Wanke: I think some of their key challenges were the efficiency of the team. It was really centralized around a few individuals who knew [00:07:00] Marketo inside out, who were kind of the linchpins in the operation, if you will, where if they were on vacation or if they were tied up in other campaigns or other initiatives everything else just got pushed further down.

And so being able to have more of a broad team in the platform, using the platform on a day to day basis really allowed them to scale, but also become much more efficient in how they operated their marketing operations team day to day. I think the other thing that we typically see, and this was certainly true in this one, was overall reporting. Reporting was really cumbersome.

They weren't able to really inform how do we do things better from a marketing perspective, based on the results we've had from previous campaigns? And so being able to have insight into that clear reporting. Being able to share that very easily with executives and with those other stakeholders in the business was a key consideration for them and one that they saw a lot of value in what we were able to offer.

And not only that, how simple we were able to make [00:08:00] it, while not caving in on the functionality they truly needed.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: What was the deal size? Like what was at stake? What was the HubSpot software makeup here? 

James Wanke: Yeah. So this one landed right around $25,000 MRR. So it was a Peer Marketing Hub play. Obviously there was a lot of contacts, marketing contacts here. Dedicated IP, transactional email and then Operations Hub naturally from more of a data cleanliness standpoint and data quality standpoint.

So, fairly sizable deal in terms of who they were marketing to, and this is an organization that again wanted to build in some room for growth as well, so that was reflected in kind of the initial agreement knowing they had some mergers and acquisitions planned for the first couple of months of their subscription here.

So, that's really what the makeup was from a partner perspective. They wanted to look at two implementation partners. They took a little bit of unique approach here in the fact that they involved competing partners in the same [00:09:00] meetings, which is a little bit unique outside of what we typically see in a sales process. But they really wanted each partner to be able to have exactly the same information and make sure that they weren't favoring one or another through their process and that way they were able to truly make an informed decision around who was best for them to get this stood up in their time frame and in their best interest, as well as who might be the best long term partner for them moving forward.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: I know as part of your role being plugged into the partner ecosystem is an important part of that. Like 

Stephen Saberin, Aptitude 8: what's in your head when you're encountering this type of deal and how do you determine who to pull in and what does that look like?

James Wanke: Yeah, really good question. Obviously, there's a lot of considerations, naturally, and 

James Wanke, HubSpot: it really is deal dependent, I would say, in terms of what the primary considerations are. But some of the ones we typically look at are expertise in the industry. 

James Wanke: I think anyone who can really speak the language in this case, HR and payroll is a little bit of [00:10:00] a unique industry while not being maybe as unique as some of the others we encounter, but being able to know who and how they typically are operating and going-to-market .What are some of the internal processes or reports that are going to be most valuable to them and 

James Wanke, HubSpot: what credibility or expertise could a partner bring that is going to not only make them feel like they aren't the guinea pig for this particular partner but, they can benefit maybe from some of the other interactions or experiences that partners had with other similar customers in the past.

James Wanke: So I think certainly industry expertise plays into this. I think personality and kind of partnership motion of some partners really prefer to get in and get out. Others prefer maybe more of a, "Hey, this is a start of a long term relationship." And so really understanding what their goals were and what they really valued in a HubSpot partner.

So in this case, they wanted to own and maintain the system moving forward. And so we needed to find a partner who is comfortable with building everything out, training their team and [00:11:00] ultimately handing the keys to them to own and maintain moving forward. So certainly that plays into it. And then I think the last thing that I'll call out is really personality match.

I think. 

James Wanke, HubSpot: A lot of times there's strong personalities or maybe unique personalities involved, both from a partner as well as a customer side that we need to account for, and that can really be the difference in what amounts to a successful partnership and a failed partnership. 

James Wanke: And so I think finding the match of who can speak to them in the way that they would like the type of engagement to go and who can ultimately meet them where they're at in terms of not dumbing down the conversation too much or not talking over their head too much. Finding the right match there is certainly important and something that was critical to this particular evaluation. 

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: So if I was to summarize, it'd be like expertise in the industry. The kind of notion, how the partner likes to work with clients, whether or not it's, more of a retainer style or more of like project driven and then personality match of [00:12:00] the team.

So how do you, from a partner perspective, right? *What helps you making those determinations beyond just former experience with working with that partner?*

James Wanke: *Yeah, I mean, I, I think Steve, what I try and do is, is get to know each partner on a personal basis. Like, I think that helps me have the credibility, the validation that whoever I'm bringing in is going to not only give, you know, my, you represent myself and my recommendation in the right light, but ultimately give HubSpot the best chance and the customer the best chance to be successful on our platform.*

*So I think the way that I typically go about that is I'll go through my notes of what previous experiences I've had, what I've learned about all these partners in the past. I'll double check that as an initial standpoint. I'll typically reach out to the partner with some details to get a validation check on them.*

*Do they have the bandwidth? Do they feel as strongly as I do about the potential partnership being a good one for them and in their best interest? And then from there, like *[00:13:00] *getting the buy in from the rest of the HubSpot team to ensure that* * knowing we're we all are going to be a part of the process from this point forward.*

*I want everybody else to be bought in and feel good about who we're bringing in as well. So, I think* *that buy in on all fronts is really important to make sure that we can all put our best foot forward and represent something that we're going to be proud of, and again, to give ourselves the best shot at winning the business at the end of the day.*

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: *I think that's super useful. And I think helpful from the partner side, right? Just to understand how we can support you guys. And, you know, we know there's a lot* of partners, right? Like, and there's a lot of, options and you're supporting a lot of deals, so. Making your job easier is something that we can probably do a better job of as well. 


James Wanke: I think from a partner perspective to just kind of building on that, I think some of the most important things we value in partners, maybe to turn it around a little bit is, I think transparency. I think there's sometimes a fear that if partners say no to a particular offering at one point in time, we're not going to bring them back [00:14:00] next time around, but I think that it's really the opposite. That helps build a lot of credibility. And the fact that you're willing to say no, when you don't feel like it's the right fit, really builds the confidence in us coming to you next time around, knowing that if you don't feel good about it, you're going to tell us. And then I think ultimately transparency, like, can you do what you say you're going to?

And, if you claim to be an industry expert, are you going to be able to showcase that when we need you to on those phone calls and those meetings with the prospect? So I think those are a couple of things too that kind of after the fact, after we bring you in, really prove that you are doing everything you can and you're able to do everything you signed up for in the beginning.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Yeah, I agree. I think that's a fantastic point. And I think that's obviously one thing that leading partnerships over here, we've tried to do with you and the team. Be super transparent and know what is a good fit for our team versus not. So I think that's a super awesome point. 

*reeling it back to the deal itself. *

Stephen Saberin, Aptitude 8: *I think one of the interesting things on this one that is unique was that they were *[00:15:00] *evaluating two partners. Not the unique part, but the unique part being that maybe those two partners were in the same meetings. *

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: *Tell me a little bit about how that came into play. *

Stephen Saberin, Aptitude 8: *Tell me a bit more about that.*

James Wanke: Absolutely. You're right. This was the first time I encountered that. I don't know how often I'll encounter it again, to be honest with you, but it was really their ask, I think, based on two reasons. Again, the equitable factor of they wanted to just make sure and double check themselves to say, "Hey, we're not giving one partner more information than the other, or we're not tipping our hand in any way, shape or form of you know, who we'd like to work with. Rather, we can, at the end of the day, say we did everything the exact same for both partners." 

And I think the other was timing. As you know, a lot of these evaluations, just based on availability, based on process, they take a lot of time and they take a lot of buy in, especially if you're going to evaluate multiple partners.

Typically, that means doubling up on the discovery, doubling up maybe on a reverse demo, doubling up on all the subsequent meetings that might take place until they make a final [00:16:00] decision. So I think they found that the best way to optimize their team's time and the best way to optimize both partner's times was just to do everything together.

Now, I will say both partners were a little bit reluctant in the beginning to say, "You know, James, are you serious here? Are we sure that this is really what we're going to do? You know, just because it is unique motion here." But I think after going through it at the end of the day, it benefited both partners and created this competitive nature, which I think breeds and brings the best out of everybody of saying, like, who you're going up against. You know exactly what information they're asking for. Right? How can you maybe best use things that maybe you typically wouldn't ask or wouldn't be aware of to your benefit and, facilitating and portraying what a potential partnership with your organization could look like. So, at the end of the day, it was no big deal, but certainly unique aspect here.

And again, like I said, I'll be interested to see if we see more of it, if that catches more of a future trend, or if that's just a one off for this particular prospect.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: [00:17:00] Yeah. I don't think I have encountered that, but it sounds like an interesting situation. From an interaction perspective, anything interesting that happened there? Was there anything unique about the relationships in the meetings or how'd that go?

James Wanke: Yeah, interestingly enough I think both partners were really quiet to start. I think neither wanted to kind of be the one to take the first step, if you will. And you could tell everyone was you kind of feeling out their roles and responsibilities throughout those first couple of minutes of the call.

But I think as we got into it, it was kind of the realization that, "Hey, we're all working towards the same goal here. We all have the same ideas of really typically what information we want and what's important to really get into. And so, despite being competitors, if you will, that both partners were able to kind of build off each other's questions to really, again, look out for what was in the best interest of the prospect and making sure that at the end of the day, they had all the information to make a truly informed decision on who was going to be best for them. So, it turns out, that [00:18:00] went on for, yeah, there was probably three to four meetings that both partners were involved with as we evolved through the process.

And both partners kind of tried to take on a unique path, if you will, of how they structured their proposal. So there was still a little bit of individualization I'll say to that. But ultimately, at the end of the day, both partners were asked to provide a proposal separately, and that was the one call they got to really pitch them over, who they knew the competitor to be in that scenario.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: *That's very interesting. Throughout that process, was there a clear front runner when it came to like that they had decided on? If so, what made them that top choice of the front runner?*

James Wanke: *Yeah, I think there was a clear front runner, I think, from our perspective. The prospect did keep the HubSpot team, I would say, a little bit in the dark on who they were leaning towards or what their feelings were, just so again, we could keep it equitable and give both partners an equal shot as well.*

*But I think we felt, and this was echoed in the final decision, that there was *[00:19:00] *a front runner throughout. And I think uniquely what they did different was they asked maybe the questions that were not your typical ones. Weren't like the canned questions. Rather, they tailored their questions and their approach really to where that customer was and where they eventually wanted to go.*

*And so I think a lot of times we see partners and it's like " **Here's** our checklist of 10 questions we need to run through today with really no thought around do we already have this information or is this truly applicable to the use case here? This particular partner really put in the time to do the research on the company, had very insightful questions as it pertained to context from previous meetings, and then ultimately kept the customer's goal in mind, rather than assuming things or making assumptions on where they should or eventually prioritize their efforts, I guess, in the early stages.*

*So I think that's what really set it apart was really just that partnership feel of saying you're going to put in the effort and you're going to meet me where I'm at. And I know you're going to continue to do that. Likely moving *[00:20:00] *forward.*

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Yeah. I think that's super important to do throughout the process. Right? Constantly uncovering new pieces there. 

On this particular one, were you guys speaking to the decision makers or did you have to prepare something to present to a board or what was the, you know, stakeholder arrangement like?

James Wanke: Yeah, really great question. So this one was unique in the fact that they had just had a lot of change up in the executive leadership team there. So there was some unfamiliarity, I would say, with the individual who is running the evaluation and ultimately who the decision maker was or who was going to be the ultimate decider of who the part the chosen partner as well as chosen vendor was in this scenario.

So that was unique aspect to navigate So we kind of just had to put our trust in this decision maker that we're eventually gonna get there But to your point we were ultimately building towards an executive presentation. Now neither partner nor HubSpot got to be the ones to actually make that pitch to leadership, and so rather we were trying to equip [00:21:00] with all the information for that individual to then go and make that pitch with all the bells and whistles that he needed to do so. 

I think the other aspect of this that isn't uncommon is that there's a budget ask. And each partner came in a little bit differently from a budgetary standpoint of what was needed to do the initial implementation. And so we also didn't know what budget was going to get approved and how that would then factor into both the decision making on vendor and the decision making on partner, because those were coming from two different buckets. One from a capital expenditure, and one from more of an operating expenditure standpoint.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Interesting. Did either partner throughout the process build ROI or LTV analysis for the stakeholder to basically take to the board to help in that decision process?

James Wanke: I think that is what set the winning partner aside here is they did put in the work to develop that LTV or that expected return on investment for what they were going to put [00:22:00] into HubSpot as well as that implementation or migration change here.

So, I think, what was interesting about this one is that the partner didn't really have a chance to maybe reveal that as early in the process as they would like because there was another partner involved and they didn't want that other partner to kind of steal what they had been putting together here.

So each partner was kind of building their case in the background and then ultimately got 30 minutes on the back end to present that. But ultimately, the winning partner did have and did put in the work to take everything they learned, put it into what they deem as a proprietary formula of what the return on investment was going to be, and then present that back, which I think went a long way in terms of leadership of knowing what we're signing up for and what we expect to get back from it. Knowing that they weren't as familiar with HubSpot or this partner in specific.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: *Sure. How critical in winning this deal do you think that was for the HubSpot team as well for the partner to do that?*

James Wanke: I think it was really [00:23:00] critical. I think it really made not only the partner, but also HubSpot stand out in terms of Predictability. Like I think anytime a new leadership team is in charge, the last thing they want is more uncertainty, especially from a marketing standpoint and kind of that top of the funnel lead generation.

So I think, knowing what they were signing up for and what they could expect from a numbers standpoint gave them a lot of certainty around being able to really feel confident that this was the right move for them. That ultimately they ended up being a no brainer based on where we came in from an investment standpoint in terms of what they were going to get out of it.

So, I do think that clarity and that level of I'll say over the top nature of really taking it to the next level outside of what they were asked to provide really provided a precedent of what the partnership could look like moving forward, too.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Gotcha. Interesting. Okay. So as you progress through the deal, there's one [00:24:00] thing I always like to ask. Were there any surprises that kind of jumped out or like forks in the road right as you're getting towards closing? Did anything like that happen that kind of took everybody by surprise for this deal? 

James Wanke: Yeah, I think the biggest one is kind of a theme that we see. Not a enjoyable theme. But we had engagements probably two to three times per week with this prospect as we were going through the bulk of the evaluation. It got around holiday time. We were talking on Christmas Eve. We were talking on New Year's Eve. You know like all the times when everybody's looking to sit back and take a break, we were continuing on knowing that we really needed to put our best foot forward if we were going to win the partnership here. So I think what then ended up happening is we got back from the holiday break. We're excited to hear an update from them and we got nothing back for two to three weeks in January.

And we knew that they were back at work, that they were in the office but we just heard nothing back from them. And so I think that level of what happened? Did we do something wrong or have they decided to go in another [00:25:00] direction? And how much do we push? Because after a couple of emails, a couple of calls, how hard do you really push on this?

Left us in a really interesting point, but ultimately we decided to give them a little bit of space. They came back to us. They were really just heads down in some other beginning of the year initiatives, some budgetary meetings in the background that they just didn't have good answers for us at this point. But I think that certainly left a lot of confusion and panic, if you will, on our side of what did we just waste our holidays for if they were ultimately just going to go dark on us after we came back from it? So, we thought we had a great plan in place. We thought this is a potential January deal and ultimately took a little bit longer than that naturally to get pushed forward. But that was an interesting one where we just had no collaboration and no insight into what was going on.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: That's always the worst when you get ghosted right at the very end of the line. When did they end up signing with HubSpot? 

James Wanke: They ended up signing with Hubspott in early February, so just a few weeks ago here. And so, they're just getting started in the implementation [00:26:00] process. They've got a pretty quick turnaround time to get off of Marketo here. So they've got about roughly a three month window here, which is a little bit tighter than we had hoped, which is also kind of building into that panic of, "Okay, every day that we're not talking to them or knowing what's going on, we're just not sure exactly where this is eventually going to pan out. When we're going to be able to get started. And so constantly adjusting plans while we're waiting to hear back, but yeah, just getting started and thus far off to a really good start and everything's looking good for getting them up and running by that end date.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: I'm at the tail end here, but again, one of the things I always like to ask is like, is there anything that you would have done differently in hindsight working this deal?

James Wanke: Yeah. I mean, I think you know, interesting enough, like we didn't bring in a partner right away. And so I think that pushed back some of the evaluation process. We kind of let them maybe run a little bit too much of the process early on and we took more of a, "Hey, we'll do what you're asking us to do versus more of a leadership role."

And so I think us may be commanding a little bit more of like "Here's the process [00:27:00] we typically operate by that we've seen work with clients just like yourself. Here's what we recommend as next steps versus taking orders from them, if you will." Would have been a way to maybe avoid some of that panic or that little bit harder cut off timeline that maybe we would have liked and been a little bit more comfortable for everybody involved.

So I think that's one not only for this deal, but I think in general we see as something that's an opportunity for us to really take more of a Thought Leadership approach and get ahead of things before they get a little bit too far down the path.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Interesting. *Very very insightful. *

Stephen Saberin, Aptitude 8: *Is there any advice that you would give to sellers working with partners and how to do that more effectively?* 

James Wanke, HubSpot: Yeah, I would say, look at partners as an extension of your team. I think quite often they've maybe got a different organization that they're associated with. And so there's not as much willingness to engage them as part of the larger team. But I think every time we don't do that or every time we delay their involvement, really just creates [00:28:00] more work for everybody and a little bit less of a united front, 

James Wanke: which we truly are in these type of engagements.

So I think invite them in early. Keep them updated often and involved in every interaction and engagement emails. Even just a blind copied attendee, so they can be aware of what's going on. And then also just set proper expectations. I think the last thing that I look to do is make sure I'm setting partners up for success and not putting them in a place to fail.

James Wanke, HubSpot: And I think lack of time, lack of availability to get the information they need to put together a proper project plan and scope of work., that's typically where we see things start to fall down and only get worse from there. 

James Wanke: So I think again, just being a truly collaborative and being that united front for the customer is ultimately what sets all of us up for success.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: *So conversely to that, *

Stephen Saberin, Aptitude 8: *what can partners do to help mitigate some of the friction during the sales process? *

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: *And I guess *

Stephen Saberin, Aptitude 8: *what piece of advice would you give them?*

James Wanke: Yeah, [00:29:00] I think obviously 

James Wanke, HubSpot: availability is a huge thing. 

James Wanke: So I think that goes without saying, but I think just being available. 

James Wanke, HubSpot: I think being collaborative, both asynchronously as well as within meetings and really being a Thought Leader too. I think the best partners not only are in it for, 

James Wanke: you know, 

James Wanke, HubSpot: selling their services, but are also in it to help HubSpot win the deal.

Because typically without HubSpot sale, there's also no partner services. 

James Wanke: And so I think 

James Wanke, HubSpot: being available, speaking your mind, being strategic around how we can all collectively best approach this really gives the credibility and gives the 

James Wanke: excitement, I would say, for our team to be that true larger team in a 

James Wanke, HubSpot: sense of putting our best foot forward.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Awesome. Appreciate the input. Thanks so much, James, for joining us and sharing your incredible insights. Story behind getting this deal across the line. It's been fascinating to hear about the challenges and the intricacies that went on behind the scenes here to help make this a [00:30:00] success.

And really appreciate you joining the show.

James Wanke: Thanks for having me, Steve. Really appreciate it.

Stephen Saberin, HubSpot: Thanks for tuning in. You can connect with me, Stephen Saberin on LinkedIn to keep the conversation going and check out Aptitude 8 at aptitude8.com to learn how we're partnering with sellers and solutions teams to drive success. Until next time, keep selling, keep learning and keep domin8ting. Thanks for tuning in. 

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